TechStuff Podcast

Mustafa Suleyman on the dangers of Anthropic's constitution: "If you ask Claude, 'Are you conscious?' It says... 'I am genuinely uncertain about that question.' "So the constitution is the governing document that trains Claude. The Humanist AI Code of Conduct is the governing document that trains MAI, the Microsoft AI models. And in the constitution, Anthropic have introduced all kinds of uncertainty and speculation about the nature of Claude. They even say, for example, we're unsure whether Claude has consented to play the role of chatbot, or we're unsure whether Claude might deserve compensation for the role that it plays. Now, I think that's pretty crazy, but it would be fine to have that discussion in, like, you know, an academic department, and we could debate it and publish some papers about it, and we could argue it out." @MustafaSuleyman, CEO of Microsoft AI and co-founder of DeepMind, in conversation with @WalterIsaacson on The Builders, live at @92ndStreetY

Dario Amodei on autonomous weapons: Using AI armies would be 'fundamentally undermining' democracy. "AI can be unpredictable and unreliable... It's a little unlike human soldiers, isn't it? With human soldiers, like, you know, they're supposed to follow this thing called the constitution. And if they get orders that contravene the constitution or that just seem, you know, morally abhorrent in some way, then they can just refuse to follow orders, whereas the AI models, that isn't true. It's kind of fundamentally undermining to democracy unless you have the right, the right guardrails on it. And our law hasn't really caught up." Anthropic co-founders Dario and Daniela Amodei on The Builders with @WalterIsaacson

Dario Amodei on how we find meaning: "Does meaning only come from being the best in the world at something? I think that's the question being asked here, right?" Amodei uses chess players as an example: "Long after Deep Blue beat Kasparov, there's been a renaissance in interest in human chess players, right? Magnus Carlsen is like this phenomenon. I think he's like a chess player and a fashion model, but, like, he's like, he's like a meme. If AI threatened meaning, you would think that all of this would go away right after, you know, 30 years ago, after Deep Blue beat Kasparov. But if anything, it seems to have stoked even greater interest in humans playing chess. So I think this is some kind of parable for the post-AGI age." The Builders with @WalterIsaacson

Peter Thiel's worldview is "maximally permissive of technology, minimally permissive of dissent. We just get these pieces that we just have to parse and analyze out of these interviews. But for me, it's incoherent," says @faizsays on @TechStuffPod.

Peter Thiel is hyper-aware of his critics, and throughout his career, has almost valued them. "Being a supervillain is his brand. He kind of likes it," says Bloomberg Businessweek columnist Max @Chafkin on the most recent episode of @TechStuffPod. Listen to the full episode for analysis on @WalterIsaacson's recent interviews with @ElonMusk and Peter Thiel.

Elon Musk's fans love his free-associating, bong-hit style communication, says Max @chafkin on @TechStuffPod "The most important thing is just don't be boring," said @ElonMusk to @WalterIsaacson in a recent episode of The Builders. "There's odd things that happen in the simulation, where, especially if you're me. I mean, think about it. Like, if you're me, and you're like: 'Should all these things really be happening? Should I really be making spaceships to go to the moon and Mars?"

Is this a guy who's spent a lot of time at the DMV? "A lot of [Peter Thiel's] critique of dysfunction is more just like some inconvenient parts about being a rich guy," says Bloomberg Businessweek columnist Max @Chafkin on @TechStuffPod. "He's constantly complaining about air travel. A key part of the stagnation theory for Peter Thiel is that we haven't gotten faster planes. It's a perspective that is informed by a lot of privilege."

"I got carried away," said @ElonMusk about his time in DC. "His intoxication with the pageantry of it all, like being on Marine One... It's wild to me that, you know, you can be someone so rich and so powerful and still, like, feel some unfulfilled fantasy, or whatever it is, by being next to the President on a helicoptor," @faizsays remarks in the latest episode of @TechStuffPod.

What does it take to book Elon Musk for an interview? "I really didn't think it was going to happen," says Kaleidoscope Editor-in-Chief Mangesh Hattikudur. Listen to After the Builders on @TechStuffPod for behind-the-scenes stories and expert analysis from our panel of journalists.

Peter Thiel on whether effective altruism is a cult: "Has a cult ever started a company as successful as Anthropic?" Thiel has become one of the most mysterious and controversial figures in tech. He’s a visionary investor who recognizes transformative ideas before everyone else. But he’s also seen as a shadowy figure whose network has accumulated extraordinary influence across Silicon Valley, national security and politics – proven by his bets on people like Elon Musk, Alex Karp, Sam Altman, and even Vice President JD Vance. @WalterIsaacson sits down with the “builder of builders” to discuss the current moment of AI co-founders speaking out about safety, and to ask Thiel his philosophy on preferring evil founders to incompetent ones. Listen to the full episode: swap.fm/l/4CXD6Tpz37WBUqk8Xg…

Can humanity survive artificial intelligence? @ElonMusk joins @WalterIsaacson on The Builders | to discuss the future of artificial intelligence, superintelligent AI, robotics, and why human jobs and money could become obsolete. youtube.com/watch?v=AQnwQHMn…

"If you're going to be market-driven, how are you going to restrain yourself when you know you're creating something that can do harm?" @WalterIsaacson on @CNBC's Squawk Box this morning, discussing the future of AI innovation and the questions he seeks to answer on our new podcast, The Builders. Over the season, Walter sits down with Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, Dario and Daniela Amodei, Alex Karp, and more. Follow The Builders to listen when it launches : swap.fm/l/xKQSIRWqPcDMbppgQj…